CR4 or DemoN or both?

[visaker]

I can't decide which or whats the advantage to get both? I just want to play backups with cheats and XBL(dont care about cheats). From my understanding:

CR4 Pros:
- Injects code on boot (RGH)
- Allows you to keep un-modded retail NAND
- great for developers (if you need to debug start up process, anything else?)
- cheaper than DemoN
- allows to read/write original nand

CR4 Cons:
- more stress on internal components(cpu/nand) while glitching
- longer boot time
- No external programming access
- No external switch to turn it off


DemoN Pros:
- doesn't glitch
- external switch
- external programming access
- no slow downs on boot
- more difficult to detect
- allows dual hard drive mod

DemoN Cons:
- no code injection
- more expansive

So DemoN seem to be more suitable for a user and CR4 for a developer/hacker?

 

[scott1503]

its not a cr4 or demon. you will have either a cr4 OR you will have a cr4 and demon.

you need to have a glitch chip installed or all you will have is 2 retail nands

 

[Krafter]

Your understanding of how this works is wrong. In a nutshell....

CR4 is a glitch chip. A glitch chip uses brute force to bypass the security checks built into the system to allow "unsigned" code to run (non-Microsfoft code) such as FreeStyleDash and other homebrew apps. The problem with that is MS can detect that and ban your console from Live if you were to login. That's where the Demon comes in. It alows your system to have both a glitched side which cannot go into Live and a retail (non-glitched) side which can go onto Live and is undetectable. It's as simple as pushing a button before power up. What's nice about the CR4 is that it's crazy fast. Other chips would take as long as 60 seconds to boot or more on some consoles if not setup and tuned properly which takes a very long time and can be challenging. The CR4 is a basic install with very little tuning needed.

A NAND is where the system firmware is stored. For a glitched system, the Microsoft firmware is modified after decrypting it with your CPU key. That modified version is written to your consoles NAND or if you have a Demon, it's written to the Demons NAND.

 

[visaker]

Ok, that clears up some of the things for me. Is there a way to add external switch(to turn it off) and external programming capability for CR4?

Also do you really have to flash custom nand for, lets say freestyle, or can CR4 just inject code to load it during boot process without storing modded nand? I'm assuming here: if nand is kept in original/retail state, not modded/not re-flashed and CR4 is off, it can not be detected.

 

[Krafter]

Like I said, there's two different NANDs with a Demon system. One on the consoles motherboard and the other on the Demon. The CR4 doesn't inject anything. It just tricks the system into allowing the modified (unsigned) code in the firmware to run which is written to and stored in the Demon. That is done once during the mod process and only again if an update is needed. The Demon will also turn off the CR4 when you turn it off from its externial button. There isn't a way to program the CR4 as its programmed from the factory and there's no need to.

Also, FreeStyleDash is also considered as unsigned so it cannot be ran without a glitched system.

 

[visaker]

I'm sorry, I think you misunderstood me, I didn't mean to program CR4 but nand. Now if I'm understanding this correctly, since CR4 doesn't insert code, it means that flashing custom nand to run homebrew apps is a must without DemoN?

 

[scott1503]

The consoles nand would be retail and when the console is switched to the demon it would in turn turn the cr4 on. The console nand holds retail and the cr4 would be disabled, the demon would hold the hacked or home brew image and would allow the cr4 to be powered

 

[Krafter]

I'm sorry, I think you misunderstood me, I didn't mean to program CR4 but nand. Now if I'm understanding this correctly, since CR4 doesn't insert code, it means that flashing custom nand to run homebrew apps is a must without DemoN?

Yes. If you don't have a Demon then you have to modify the onboard NAND.

 

[visaker]

scott1503 I think I understand the DemoN part now, just trying to figure out the CR4. Thanks

 

[visaker]

Yes. If you don't have a Demon then you have to modify the onboard NAND.

Thats so weird, I always thought glitching involved inserting code because from what Ive read, thats how smartcards exploited.

 

[Krafter]

Read my first reply again. A CR aka CoolRunner is just a sophisticated timing/counter/logical device to circumvent the built in M$ security. Nothing more. The CR4 has dip switches to change the timing of the resets, some greater filtering of the logic signals and probably a lot more sh*t than I known about.

 

[Krafter]

Thats so weird, I always thought glitching involved inserting code because from what Ive read, thats how smartcards exploited.

The code is inserted via a NAND reader/writer. That's either with a JR Programmer (or similar) or via the Demon and its USB interface.

 

[Krafter]

Check this video out. He's a member here.

[video=youtube_share;NSDMolE1OR4]http://youtu.be/NSDMolE1OR4 [/video]

 

[Krafter]

Be sure to watch the rest of his videos in this series. He's good at walking through the entire process.

 

[visaker]

Check this video out. He's a member here.

OMG hes got same coffee table as I do! Good video though, thanks! :eek2:

 

[ultimate360]

Check this video out. He's a member here.

[video=youtube_share;NSDMolE1OR4]http://youtu.be/NSDMolE1OR4 [/video]

He's still got those finger nails too

Look at his old vids, same nails lol

Keil makes good vids though

 

[visaker]

He's still got those finger nails too

Look at his old vids, same nails lol

Keil makes good vids though

lol I didn't notice that but at least he wont need to use tweezers as much ...