R-JTAG Slightly botched my DemoN install...!! Can I continue without reading internal NAND?

peanutismint

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May 11, 2014
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So here's the deal - I'm installing a CR4 XL on a phat Falcon to do R-JTAG+ and I got a DemoN to allow me to run dual NANDs. Unfortunately, I messed up some of my quick solder points and had to de-solder, and think I've managed to burn off one or two of the pads during the process :-( So now I can read/write to the DemoN NAND fine, but it can't read/write the Xbox NAND at all (I get the "manufacturer for code ff not found" error)

I haven't modded an Xbox since 2003...!! So forgive my slightly hazy knowledge, but is there a way I can still go ahead with this install by using the DemoN's NAND as my one and only NAND? Or am I absolutely scuppered without the Xbox NAND? and, if so, is there a way to move forward, either by repairing those burned pads or by soldering to another point on the board??
 

ultimate360

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The demon feeds its nand into the Xbox through those points, it has to be repaired. How bad is the damage, can we see a pic?
 

peanutismint

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I don't think you can see much unless I un-solder it. This is how it looks now. WARNING: GRAPHIC PCB GORE :)

8tfOZMJl.jpg

1qoyqC6l.jpg

I thought about trying to scratch through to the copper beds and re-solder but I didn't wanna make it worse so I thought I'd seek help from a 'pro'! So if you can suggest anything I'm all ears.
 
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BL4K3Y

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Each NAND point on the DemoN has to be connected to an XBOX 360 NAND point.

I can tell straight away that you are not using flux (and if you are, you are not using it correctly).

The best advice I can give you is to send your board to a pro and let them fix the damage before you make things worse.

I know you said you haven't installed a mod chip or anything similar since 2003, but the DemoN is not an original XBOX mod chip and it is much more difficult to install.
 
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peanutismint

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I was using flux - tell me how to use it correctly. I applied it to the points on the board (and the DemoN) before soldering... Am I missing something?

So what method would a 'pro' use to fix this? I know you're just going to tell me not to make it worse but just for argument's sake... Would I be along the right lines with exposing more of the copper pad and trying to re-solder?
 

BL4K3Y

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I was using flux - tell me how to use it correctly. I applied it to the points on the board (and the DemoN) before soldering... Am I missing something?

So what method would a 'pro' use to fix this? I know you're just going to tell me not to make it worse but just for argument's sake... Would I be along the right lines with exposing more of the copper pad and trying to re-solder?
I can't tell from those images if you have managed to lift any of the NAND VIA points.

If you have, the only way to fix this is to solder directly to the NAND pins on top of the board.

Look at the photo I have attached to this post - that is how the DemoN quick solder points should look.

Some people recommend using less solder, but this particular install was checked with a multimeter and there were no adjacent solder bridges.
 

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ultimate360

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Looks like you have 3 lifted pads (from what I can see). My advice with flux usage on those demon points is to flood it with flux, I also use kingbo RMA 218 flux which is FANTASTIC for everything. If you need someone to check out that console, I'd be more than than happy to help you out :)

EDIT: or try what Blakey said if you feel up for it
 
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peanutismint

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Ok thanks - That's a good looking solder job. Annoyingly, mine almost looked like this before I had to desolder and messed it all up! I hardly used any solder because I didn't want to accidentally bridge any of the points.

So if I have lifted the NAND VIA points, is there any info available about possibly soldering directly to the NAND pins? Also, if I'm reasonably confident that the other set of quick solder points are fine, is it worth me desoldering (again!) to get you a photo of the possibly burned pads or just assume they're done for and try soldering directly to the NAND?
 

BL4K3Y

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So if I have lifted the NAND VIA points, is there any info available about possibly soldering directly to the NAND pins? Also, if I'm reasonably confident that the other set of quick solder points are fine, is it worth me desoldering (again!) to get you a photo of the possibly burned pads or just assume they're done for and try soldering directly to the NAND?
Solder each point again and use a multimeter to check that there are no solder bridges between points.

Once you have done this, you must then check that each DemoN NAND point is connected to it's respective XBOX 360 NAND point (do a continuity test from the DemoN's test points to the NAND pins on top of the board).
 

peanutismint

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Looks like you have 3 lifted pads (from what I can see). My advice with flux usage on those demon points is to flood it with flux, I also use kingbo RMA 218 flux which is FANTASTIC for everything. If you need someone to check out that console, I'd be more than than happy to help you out :)

EDIT: or try what Blakey said if you feel up for it
Hey thanks man, much appreciated. I think I may have managed to get a couple of pins connected by pushing a little harder with my soldering iron, but I didn't want to push/heat too hard (that's probably how I got into this mess in the first place!).

I'd love to know how to check (using my multimeter) which pads are no good... Any chance you know which points to meter and what to look for? Also, if it comes to it, might it just be easier for me to direct solder to the NAND? Or are we talking hundreds of tiny IC legs really close together?!
 

peanutismint

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Solder each point again and use a multimeter to check that there are no solder bridges between points.

Once you have done this, you must then check that each DemoN NAND point is connected to it's respective XBOX 360 NAND point (do a continuity test from the DemoN's test points to the NAND pins on top of the board).
Sorry BL4K3Y, think we're playing forum pong :) Thanks mate, I'll try that with a meter now... Is it reasonably obvious where the NAND points are?? And are the quicksolder pins laid out in the same order/orientation as the NAND points I'll want to meter?
 

BL4K3Y

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if it comes to it, might it just be easier for me to direct solder to the NAND? Or are we talking hundreds of tiny IC legs really close together?!
The NAND pins have a gap of about 1MM between them.

Soldering to these pins is one of the more difficult repairs I have had to do.

Follow the instructions in my previous post to check for a connection between points.
 
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peanutismint

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Thanks so much for the continued help. So I've checked them all and I think two of the 'bad' points are bridged, so I can re-do those, but I wouldn't know how to check whether the quicksolder points are actually connecting to anything of if the pads underneath have bitten the dust... Is there any info pointing to where to meter elsewhere on the board to check??
 

BL4K3Y

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I wouldn't know how to check whether the quicksolder points are actually connecting to anything of if the pads underneath have bitten the dust... Is there any info pointing to where to meter elsewhere on the board to check??
This is what I explained above.

Do a continuity test from the DemoN test points to the NAND pins on top of the board.
 

gavin_darkglide

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The NAND pins have a gap of about 1MM between them.

Soldering to these pins is one of the more difficult repairs I have had to do.

Follow the instructions in my previous post to check for a connection between points.
Aint that the truth, the last repair i did like this, was ugly. those tiny nand pin pads are hard to solder to, and a couple of the ones i hardly touched with the iron, and they came right off the board. I would defiantly look into getting a pro to do this, unless you are sure your comfortable doing this, and trace repairs if you fail miserably.
 

peanutismint

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Yeah, I have a couple of friends who are MUCH better at this stuff than I am. I might go to them if I can't salvage this myself, but I'd like to at least TRY to dig my way out first....
 

gavin_darkglide

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Yeah, I have a couple of friends who are MUCH better at this stuff than I am. I might go to them if I can't salvage this myself, but I'd like to at least TRY to dig my way out first....
Good Luck then. Be careful, those pins are also easy to bridge, the last repair I had to do like this took 4 hours, a lot swearing, and a very steady hand. Lucky for you, you only have 3 or 4 wires, this one all of the qsb points were gone.
 

peanutismint

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IMG_6239.JPG

Here's a close up with the DemoN removed... anyone know if these look salvageable? I'm also doing my best to clean up the QS points on the DemoN itself... I've also got some conducting silver; wondering if I could put some of that in the pad holes??
 

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You will have to solder wires directly to the nand.

Like Bl4k3y said.. Send it to a pro. the nand legs are tricky unless you know what your doing.